News — 10 September 2011
Miramichi News: language duality in New Brunswick is a can of worms few people want to open (again). Some think it is too late for the debate, some think it would be too expensive to change things now. Read More…
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Michael Maloney
Both sides can debate all they want, reality is that we are a poor province and we can not afford two health and education authorities. In New Brunswick we have apartheid and segregation and many are tired of the conflict created by government between francos and anglos. Bilingualism is not working.
Michael Maloney
NB needs a referendum concerning the continuation of offical bilingualism.
paul sullivan
for the love of jesus ,h . have some sense ,speak what ever language you want ,it is already a bi-lingual province quit wasting time and money on bullshit .lets try creating some work back there so some of us can move back home and not have to be on welfare or pogie
frank clancy
Strangely It always seems the majority of who want to debate bilingualism are English Speakers but not much debate they want one language ENGLISH! They have wanted it before 1755 and they want it after! Acadians will always have to guard and defend their language culture and heritage and im sure they know it!! ……….Frank Clancy
S. Forrest
I am sorry to read about this today. The premier at the time made this a bilingual province, what are we still complaining about? It wasn’t suppose to be segregated French OR English. It is suppose to be both. Nobody is going to lose their identity, only if they let it happen. Come on folks, I think we could be spending our money and time on more important issues. I quote “A bilingual country is not one where all the inhabitants necessarily have to speak two languages; rather it is a country where the principal public and private institutions must provide services in two languages to the citizens, the vast majority of whom may well be unilingual. I think we are forgetting the initial purpose.
Michael Maloney
I disagree, Anglophones now need to defend their language rights due to government hiring and promotion practices and position creations. What we now have in New Brunswick is reverse discrimination.
Michael Maloney
I disagree, Anglophones now need to defend their language rights due to government hiring and promotion practices and position creations. What we now have in New Brunswick is reverse discrimination. And this reverse discrimination due to bilingualism is keeping our province down. We need a referendum.
Michael Maloney
What is your solution to our bilingual problems in poor old New Brunswick Frank?
Michael Maloney
Good point Mr Forest, however, there are many in this province who speak a language other than French or English as a second language. And we see the same in other provinces of Canada, notably Ontario and British Columbia, and we can not forget the prairies. 60% of British Columbia is non-white, and most of these fine people are from Asia. Toronto and the area known as the Golden Corridor is becoming like British Columbia. In the prairies we see huge numbers of German, Ukrainians, Poles, and yet we say to these fine people, even though you speak several languages you are not bilingual because to be bilingual in Canada one must be fluent in French and English. Seems to be something wrong with this picture.
suspicious
The issue should be duality …do we need equal infrastructures for both linguistics..I think not..as long as
bilingual services are respected.
In this day and age where cutbacks are the reality , someone has got to have the courage to stand up
and talk about this issue and not worry about what is so called politically correct . sadly no one in Government
is allowed to speak or simply ask the question without being told to apologize as happened in Saint John.
whether we want to admit it or not …this issue of costs of duality is boiling below the surface…and it seems
that the radicals are winning….
Michael Maloney
There are many in this province who speak a language other than French or English as a second language. And we see the same in other provinces of Canada, notably Ontario and British Columbia, and we can not forget the prairies. 60% of British Columbia is non-white, and most of these fine people are from Asia. Toronto and the area known as the Golden Corridor is becoming like British Columbia. In the prairies we see huge numbers of German, Ukrainians, Poles, and yet we say to these fine people, even though you speak several languages you are not bilingual because to be bilingual in Canada one must be fluent in French and English. Seems to be something wrong with this picture.
Michael Maloney
Frank, France lost. Acadians were given a choice in 1755 – swear an oath to never take up arms against the crown or leave, transportation and safe passage to be provided. Those who were deported chose to be deported, they would no swear allegiance to the British Crown – their choice. France did not give people from other regions of its colonial takeovers a choice. France used the firing squad and the guillotine to solve its problems, as well as the severing of arms, etc, etc, etc
D'Arcy
People like Jean-Marie Nadau’s columes in the weekend Telegraph should be responsible for dividing the acadians and the rest of the province. My job was replaced with a bilingual position after 3 years. Thanks !
Michael Maloney
Frank, 1755? This is now 2011, 256 years later? Do we have a problem in New Brunswick – your damn right we do. Get over it, France lost 256 years ago. Look to tomorrow, and a better New Brunswick, a New Brunswick that is not poverty stricken, a New Brunswick that does not discriminate against non-francophone, a New Brunswick that is not conflict oriented, a New Brunswick that is self supporting and we better start working together very soon before hard reality sets in 2014 when our provincial budget will be cut by 40% , because equalisation payments are due to end. One system for health care and education.
frank clancy
An Act Recognizing the Equality of the
Two Official Linguistic Communities
in New Brunswick is LAW ..Mike get over it
Reverse discrimination is a term often used by a dominant group or culture reacting to a policy change that includes minorities or groups suffering from discrimination causing the dominant group to resent change to the status quo
As far as the ending of equalization payments from the federal government it is an EXCELLENT point Mike if not the major point of the discussion The loss of Federal funding is a major problem for NB and even more so for Miramichi it in fact it amounts to an economic disaster !
It means more job loss for Miramichi more young families leaving the river less tax base decreased bilingualism government health transportation and other services that make a community viable will cause further stagnation n deterioration of our economies
We are perilously close to the point where it will be harder too justify a medical facility like we have now because of the french and english speaking population loss
We came perilously close this time but thanks to CUPE members like Jim Stuart and others any attempt to reduce services seems to have lost favour with min Dube But with federal funding cuts it may raise its ugly head again Mike you need to address this to your anglophone majority Conservative federal government immediately Increase federal spending equalization payments stop the closure of well paying Federal JOBS and begin a program recognizing the economic damage done to Miramichi by federal government and industry over the years develop a program that supports heath n education bilingualism transportation gun safety and other endeavours that make a community whole
Bilingualism will be nothing more than a distraction when the FEDS cut transfers defund health care and introduce a For profit American health care system The plus side Mike is it will be Unilingual English as there is no requirement for private business to be bilingual!
The first thing the Nurse will ask you if(god forbid) and when u have to go to hospital mike is
“Mr Maloney I didnt say CAN I CHECK YOUR BLOOD PRESSURE!!… I SAID CAN I CHECK YOUR CREDIT CARD !!” then whispers to her aide I Think hes unilingually deaf!!
Michael Maloney
Lol, now Frank. Maybe it is time to change the law in NB. Is it time to change our incomplete Constitution (Quebec did not sign it) so we can remove New Brunswick’s bilingual status and begin to move forward instead of backwards. Maybe we can even begin to teach Chinese in our schools, as we are in what is now termed the Asian Century.. so we can begin to prosper, bilingualism in NB has failed.
Michael Maloney
Reverse discrimination is when government, an organisation or other parties give unfair advantage to a minority at the expense of the majority. It utilises what is termed equity and government is to blame.
Michael Maloney
Conservative, ya right, but might be an option. It is not about Liberal. It is not about Conservative. It is about putting this province back on track and presently we are so far off the mark it is not funny. So Frank, how do you propose NB gets back on track?
Michael Maloney
Maybe it is time to declare the Act null and void? Maybe it is time for a referendum on our failed bilingualism?
Michael Maloney
Frank, comment proposez-vous que NB revient en bonne santé?
frank clancy
So mike I guess what your saying is this isnt political (lib or con) its about getting “back on track”
Getting back on track “is am American slogan I dont quite understand unless your talking about Railways Its like saying “taking out country back ” when I hear American tea partyers say that I think they must mean back to before the 1964 civil rights Act where REVERSE discrimination was never heard of just lots of plain ole discrimination !! I
We need a comprehensive economic plan to protect our universal health care out duality The unique things that make us Canadian and different from out neighbours to the south and that cant be done unless we have Economic support from our federal and provincial government Eliminating duality is Penny wise and Pound foolish
Michael Maloney
Frank you are good at tangents. This has nothing to do with the Americans, their health care system or the Boston Tea party. I do agree, we do need a comrpehensive economic plan that leans well into the future.
Michael Maloney
Now what are your specifcs?
Michael Maloney
In theory only the majority can discriminate against the majority, the minority can not discriminate against the majority, but you and I both know this premise is gravely flawed. Thus we have what is reverse discrimination and it is fully acceptable under law. But fair hiring practices can start to curb this NB trend.
Michael Maloney
Fair hiring practices based on best qualified using standard hiring practices need to be legislated.
Michael Maloney
1. So fair hiring practices legislation is one possible solution to NB bilingual problems.
Michael Maloney
2. One unified health care system and one unified education system, instead of duality, is another possible beginning solution and this move will reduce ecomomic costs.
Michael Maloney
2. continued … and possibly lead to improved offerings
Michael Maloney
3. However, if NB is adamant about being bilingual even though we are a poor province, and the only province that has said we will be bilingual, then bilingual does not mean segregation. Bilingual means one system of education and one system of health care.
Michael Maloney
4. Further to one system of education, French and English must be given equal time, the morning could be in French and the afternoon could be in English. All students, French and English, upon graduation are given language proficiency tests using the federal exam standards and criterion and not NB’s. This exam should consist of both oral (to be recorded in case marking is challenged) and written to be kept on file for a given period of time. The downside with this 50%/50% time allotment is that we know that to learn a language well the best subjects taught are the humanities, so there is a downside to the maths and sciences (and we all know math and science are where the future is) . So it is a trade off, but bilingual means bilingual.
Michael Maloney
5. Now, given the population demographics and the changing world economy etc (the Asian Century) , somewhere we need to begin to teach Chinese – opportunities abound with future trade with 1 billion people. But we must learn their culture.
Michael Maloney
6. The question perhaps becomes, do we learn the language of diplomacy as determined by government, or do we learn the language of economic opportunity. Canada total export to Franco nations is less than 3% (might be as low as 1 1/2 %) and china has become our second largest trading partners trading with the west and Ontario. We can use some of the Chinese wealth and investment in NB. Logically, in our poor province, with thought, many would tend to lean toward future prosperity and want their children taught Chinese – just like in other parts of Canada and the USA – for future opportunity.
Michael Maloney
7. NB population demographics, can be considered concerning employment practices and promotion practices (government) as realised within our province. On the one hand we have the francophone who claims his language is being weakened. It may be, it is around the world as is evidenced in the continent of Africa where former French colonies are opting for English as the primary/secondary language ( wealthier neighbouring nations and trade opportunities are in English). In Asia (China, India Pakistan and other nations) they are teaching English as the second language, not French.
Michael Maloney
Frank you are good at tangents. This has nothing to do with the Americans, their health care system or the Boston Tea party. I do agree, we do need a comrpehensive economic plan that leans well into the future.
Michael Maloney
Frank – Now what are your specifcs?
Michael Maloney
In theory only the majority can discriminate against the majority, the minority can not discriminate against the majority, but you and I both know this premise is gravely flawed. Thus we have what is reverse discrimination and it is fully acceptable under law. But fair hiring practices can start to curb this NB trend.
Michael Maloney
1. So fair hiring practices legislation is one possible solution to NB bilingual problems.
Michael Maloney
2. One unified health care system and one unified education system, instead of duality, is another possible beginning solution and this move will reduce ecomomic costs.
Michael Maloney
3. However, if NB is adamant about being bilingual even though we are a poor province, and the only province that has said we will be bilingual, then bilingual does not mean segregation. Bilingual means one system of education and one system of health care.
Michael Maloney
4. Further to one system of education, French and English must be given equal time, the morning could be in French and the afternoon could be in English. All students, French and English, upon graduation are given language proficiency tests using the federal exam standards and criterion and not NB’s. This exam should consist of both oral (to be recorded in case marking is challenged) and written to be kept on file for a given period of time. The downside with this 50/50 time allotment is that we know that to learn a language well the best subjects taught are the humanities, so there is a downside to the maths and sciences (and we all know math and science are where the future is) . So it is a trade off, but bilingual means bilingual.
Michael Maloney
5. Now, given the population demographics and the changing world economy etc (the Asian Century) , somewhere we need to begin to teach Chinese – opportunities abound with future trade with 1 billion people. But we must learn their culture.
Michael Maloney
6. The question perhaps, becomes, do we learn the language of diplomacy as determined by government, or do we learn the language of economic opportunity. Canadas total export to Franco nations is less than 3% (might be as low as 1 1/2 %) and china has become our second largest trading partners trading with the west and Ontario (next to the USA). We can use some of the Chinese wealth and investment in NB. Logically, in our poor province, with thought, many would tend to lean toward future prosperity and want their children taught Chinese – just like in other parts of Canada and the USA – for future opportunity.
Michael Maloney
7. NB population demographics, can be considered concerning employment practices and promotion practices (government) as realised within our province. On the one hand we have the francophone who claims his language is being weakened. It may be, it is around the world as is evidenced in the continent of Africa where former French colonies are opting for English as the primary/secondary language ( wealthier neighbouring nations and trade opportunities are in English). In Asia (China, India Pakistan and other nations) they are teaching English as the second language, not French.
Michael Maloney
8. The population breakdown in NB is approximately 30% franco, 70% anglo and somewhere in the mix is about 2% other. Perhaps it is time to adapt to our population within government. If all positions at the lower and upper levels to be designated Anglophone, 30% to be designated francophone, and 2% other – take one percent from francophone and Anglophone. Top managerial positions can be the same. With such a fair proposal, to end the bilingual clash, maybe we will begin to move forward, stop NB infighting between anglo and franco, and when this happens outside businesses might be more open to moving into our province to do business. Provincial coffers expand, employment increases, and we can get on with future prosperity for the long term for the benefit of our province and all within. This is fair, and I do not think any fair minded individual would object, unless of course they had ulterior motives.
Englishboy
Mike, while I agree with what you say, do you think you could have said it in less than 37 posts. It’s not much of a debate when you are talking to yourself.
Vicki
I agree Englishboy. I almost fell asleep reading Mike’s never-ending posts, although I completely disagree with his thoughts. I am French, but I am much more comfortable communicating in English, mostly due to the fact that when I was younger, getting service in French was practically impossible, and even to this day, some English people will still laugh in a French person’s face and insult them. And even in the past few years, I’ve heard of bilingual employees at the hospital getting insulted by English employees because the bilingual employee would get hired full time before the English employee.
I hate that the English and French communities are so divided, and blame goes to both sides, not just one. Everyone should just stop all this fighting and insults and get along.